Back to College

A couple of points from the only person in the discussion who couldn't have gotten into Stern:

• As much as we're focusing on the Stern/Ivy dilemma, at least as important is the decision to be made much more frequently is between Stern & other schools - Rutgers, Queens, NYU etc. Much of the conversation applies, but not all of it. And while I can understand why a student might choose not to go to Stern in favor of one of these other schools, I can think of few situations where and often a determining factor is...
• Money - to me the best reason to go to neither Stern or the Ivies. We say that you can't put a price on a great education, but I think that is not literal. If your parents are paying for it, then they have even more of a voice in your decision, and if they aren't picking up the tab, then unless you have significant scholarship money coming in, you're talking about a lot of student loans which will have a real impact on your future decisions, especially if you follow it up with graduate school.
• As to the conversation itself, I'll share my experience. I was in YU for college, and then was in an Ivy law school, and in comparing the smartest, most talented & dedicated people in my classes, there was certainly no drop off - the cream of YU's crop was every bit the match for my law school peers; if anything the contrary. Where I did feel the difference was with the rest of the class. While YU had a wide range of students academically, motivationally etc., everyone in law school was there for a reason. I assume this is true in the undergraduate schools as well.
• I'm glad to hear that the Columbia campus life for Orthodox Jews is as strong as it sounds. When I was there, I was not as impressed (- Disclaimer: I never lived on campus). I found a lot of religious drifting, with everyone going to Wednesday night learning & 4:20 Mincha, and convincing themselves and each other that they were not actually slipping religiously, but I'm not sure it was true. Especially on the campuses with the bigger communities, there is more support if the campus is spiritually vibrant, but also more support for a gradual decline if everyone else is doing it. Advance research on this front is crucial for a responsible decision.
• Finally, as I read through the posts, and kept seeing people talking about how you "have to know yourself", and whether you are the kind of person who can be self-motivated and thrive in a challenging environment. This is a lot harder than it sounds. I think you need to know yourself in terms of what else you want and need to get out of college, and then factor the potential gains and dangers of the various Jewish communities, but as Ms. Appel pointed out, looking to grow religiously by intentionally putting yourself in a challenging religious environment, on the theory that "whatever doesn't kill me makes me stronger" seems like a bad idea.